Re: Fanboi's lament - falling out of love with the iPad

[nospam]

In article <1u65069v840lksrpjovrggv9s8cn62oefm@4ax.com>, John Navas
<jnspam1@navasgroup.com> wrote:

> >They said the same crap about the iPhone. Yet again the last laugh will
> >be on them.
>
> Tell that to those of us with Android phones that cost us less, give us
> more, and don't limit us to AT&T. :D

android phones are just catching up to iphones and the at&t exclusivity
is going to end, probably sooner than people think.

android 2.2 *adds* the ability to back up user's data (amazingly, it
was not there before), and that's an api call that an app has to make.
wtf!! on an iphone, the user's data is automatically backed up. it
'just works.'

here's one example, and note that android 2.1 was *just* released (may
19). 2.2 is a *ways* off (see below).

<http://www.htc.com/us/support/hero-sprint/downloads>
WARNING: Installing this software will erase your current user data.
Please see instructions below for details.
....
Text and picture messages will be deleted with this software update.*
You can back up text and picture messages by forwarding them to an
email address.
....
Applications will be deleted with this software update.* You will
need to re-download the desired applications from the Market after
this update completes.

seriously, who thought deleting the user's data is a good idea?

android 2.2 adds tethering, something the iphone has had for a year.
although at&t doesn't support it on the iphone, just about every other
carrier does. google did do a nice job with making it create a wifi
hotspot, but it remains to be seen how many carriers will support it,
and since the carriers can modify the code (it's open source, after
all), they could disable tethering entirely. sprint has announced it's
going to be $30/mo *more* for tethering.

it also adds exchange support, something the iphone has had for 2
years, and still does not have in-app purchases.

but the real kicker is android 2.2 is not out yet unless you own a
nexus one. it may be until the *end of the year* for some devices, or
maybe not at all, like the t-mobile g1 that's still being sold. 2.1 is
the end of the line for g1 users, a phone that's less than 2 years old.

[Dennis Ferguson]

On 2010-05-30, nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:
> In article <1u65069v840lksrpjovrggv9s8cn62oefm@4ax.com>, John Navas
><jnspam1@navasgroup.com> wrote:
>> Tell that to those of us with Android phones that cost us less, give us
>> more, and don't limit us to AT&T. :D
>
> android phones are just catching up to iphones and the at&t exclusivity
> is going to end, probably sooner than people think.

How soon do people think AT&T exclusivity is going to end?

> android 2.2 adds tethering, something the iphone has had for a year.
> although at&t doesn't support it on the iphone, just about every other
> carrier does.

My iPhone can be tethered on about 12% of the carriers the phone
can be used with. That's "just about every other carrier"?

> all), they could disable tethering entirely. sprint has announced it's
> going to be $30/mo *more* for tethering.

Why is that surprising? That's what Verizon and AT&T charge as well
(I don't know what T-Mobile charges, it might be cheaper).

Dennis Ferguson

[nospam]

In article <slrni05rc8.5k.dcferguson@akit-ferguson.com>, Dennis
Ferguson <dcferguson@pacbell.net> wrote:

> >> Tell that to those of us with Android phones that cost us less, give us
> >> more, and don't limit us to AT&T. :D
> >
> > android phones are just catching up to iphones and the at&t exclusivity
> > is going to end, probably sooner than people think.
>
> How soon do people think AT&T exclusivity is going to end?

people keep claiming there was a 5 year exclusive, despite nothing
official, which would mean 2012. it won't be that long.

it will definitely go away when all carriers deploy lte which should
start late this year and into next year, so i'd say 2011 at the latest.

the question is, will the exclusive go away before 2011, as in this
year sometime? we might find out next week...

> > android 2.2 adds tethering, something the iphone has had for a year.
> > although at&t doesn't support it on the iphone, just about every other
> > carrier does.
>
> My iPhone can be tethered on about 12% of the carriers the phone
> can be used with. That's "just about every other carrier"?

how many subscribers does that cover? and we're one week away from the
official announcement of 4.0, which is rumoured to have enhancements to
tethering.

> > all), they could disable tethering entirely. sprint has announced it's
> > going to be $30/mo *more* for tethering.
>
> Why is that surprising?

it's not surprising at all. it's just that android fanbois point out
how much better tethering is on android (and the wifi hotspot is
definitely nice), but so far the ability to do so hasn't been released
yet except on one model phone only on one carrier (where have i heard
this before?)

> That's what Verizon and AT&T charge as well
> (I don't know what T-Mobile charges, it might be cheaper).

i don't think t-mobile is currently charging extra for tethering with
the nexus one. they're #4 so they might want to woo a few more
customers. who knows how long that will last though.

[nospam]

In article <jp5606trll5fq9nnaarjk4jtihq96vkiu6@4ax.com>, John Navas
<jnspam1@navasgroup.com> wrote:

> >> android phones are just catching up to iphones and the at&t exclusivity
> >> is going to end, probably sooner than people think.
> >
> >How soon do people think AT&T exclusivity is going to end?
>
> When the 5 year exclusivity deal runs out;

that's my point. people think it's five years, but the length of the
contract has *never* been made public. anyone who quotes a specific
length is guessing.

> i.e., don't hold your breath.

i.e., you're wrong (again).

[Jolly Roger]

In article <slrni05rc8.5k.dcferguson@akit-ferguson.com>,
Dennis Ferguson <dcferguson@pacbell.net> wrote:

> On 2010-05-30, nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:
> > In article <1u65069v840lksrpjovrggv9s8cn62oefm@4ax.com>, John Navas
> ><jnspam1@navasgroup.com> wrote:
> >> Tell that to those of us with Android phones that cost us less, give us
> >> more, and don't limit us to AT&T. :D
> >
> > android phones are just catching up to iphones and the at&t exclusivity
> > is going to end, probably sooner than people think.
>
> How soon do people think AT&T exclusivity is going to end?
>
> > android 2.2 adds tethering, something the iphone has had for a year.
> > although at&t doesn't support it on the iphone, just about every other
> > carrier does.
>
> My iPhone can be tethered on about 12% of the carriers the phone
> can be used with. That's "just about every other carrier"?

Actually, the iPhone tether with AT&T, or with any other provider.

--
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[nospam]

In article <jollyroger-41B59D.22571930052010@news.individual.net>,
Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:

> Actually, the iPhone tether with AT&T, or with any other provider.

actually, it doesn't. the iphone does not tether with at&t at this time
due to at&t's incompetence.

that may change in 4.0.

[Jolly Roger]

In article <300520102110460048%nospam@nospam.invalid>,
nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:

> In article <jollyroger-41B59D.22571930052010@news.individual.net>,
> Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:
>
> > Actually, the iPhone tether with AT&T, or with any other provider.
>
> actually, it doesn't. the iphone does not tether with at&t at this time
> due to at&t's incompetence.
>
> that may change in 4.0.

Actually I just tethered my iPad to my iPhone yesterday, and I am on
AT&T. It absolutely does tether.

--
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
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JR

[nospam]

In article <jollyroger-27DD43.09174831052010@news.individual.net>,
Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:

> > > Actually, the iPhone tether with AT&T, or with any other provider.
> >
> > actually, it doesn't. the iphone does not tether with at&t at this time
> > due to at&t's incompetence.
> >
> > that may change in 4.0.
>
> Actually I just tethered my iPad to my iPhone yesterday, and I am on
> AT&T. It absolutely does tether.

then you hacked it and are in violation of at&t's terms of service.

[Jolly Roger]

In article <310520100935284742%nospam@nospam.invalid>,
nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:

> In article <jollyroger-27DD43.09174831052010@news.individual.net>,
> Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:
>
> > > > Actually, the iPhone tether with AT&T, or with any other provider.
> > >
> > > actually, it doesn't. the iphone does not tether with at&t at this time
> > > due to at&t's incompetence.
> > >
> > > that may change in 4.0.
> >
> > Actually I just tethered my iPad to my iPhone yesterday, and I am on
> > AT&T. It absolutely does tether.
>
> then you hacked it and are in violation of at&t's terms of service.

I jail broke it, sure, but it was as easy as clicking a button. I
couldn't care less about AT&T's terms of service, to be honest. I don't
use tethering all that often to begin with, and data is data so it
should be an option, IMO. Plus AT&T falsely advertised that tethering
would be available long ago and has long since missed that date.

--
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
messages through their servers, I often ignore posts from Google
Groups. Use a real news client if you want me to see your posts.

JR

[nospam]

In article <jollyroger-207BF7.14045831052010@news.individual.net>,
Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:

> > > > > Actually, the iPhone tether with AT&T, or with any other provider.
> > > >
> > > > actually, it doesn't. the iphone does not tether with at&t at this time
> > > > due to at&t's incompetence.
> > > >
> > > > that may change in 4.0.
> > >
> > > Actually I just tethered my iPad to my iPhone yesterday, and I am on
> > > AT&T. It absolutely does tether.
> >
> > then you hacked it and are in violation of at&t's terms of service.
>
> I jail broke it, sure, but it was as easy as clicking a button.

it may be easy, but the iphone can't tether to at&t unless you do, and
only with certain firmwares and appropriate configuration file. most
people don't jailbreak either. the fact remains that tethering with
at&t is not supported.

> I couldn't care less about AT&T's terms of service, to be honest.

that's nice. do you just abide by whatever agreements you feel like?

> I don't
> use tethering all that often to begin with, and data is data so it
> should be an option, IMO. Plus AT&T falsely advertised that tethering
> would be available long ago and has long since missed that date.

so you admit there is no tethering with at&t, and yes, they're
incompetent buffoons.

the sooner the iphone goes multi-carrier, the better. one survey even
claims as many as 40% of at&t iphone users might jump ship (6 million
subscribers). that seems high, but if even half that switch, not to
mention a huge drop in new subscribers to at&t, they're going to be
hurting, big time.

<http://tech.fortune.cnn.com/2010/05/...att-for-verizo
n-iphone/>

the funny thing is, once the iphone is available on verizon, sprint
and/or t-mobile, and *they* offer tethering, at&t will somehow figure
out how to enable it for the iphone. then again, if 6 million users
jump ship, all that capacity can handle the extra load for tethering.

[Jolly Roger]

In article <310520101229542685%nospam@nospam.invalid>,
nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:

> In article <jollyroger-207BF7.14045831052010@news.individual.net>,
> Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > > Actually, the iPhone tether with AT&T, or with any other provider.
> > > > >
> > > > > actually, it doesn't. the iphone does not tether with at&t at this
> > > > > time
> > > > > due to at&t's incompetence.
> > > > >
> > > > > that may change in 4.0.
> > > >
> > > > Actually I just tethered my iPad to my iPhone yesterday, and I am on
> > > > AT&T. It absolutely does tether.
> > >
> > > then you hacked it and are in violation of at&t's terms of service.
> >
> > I jail broke it, sure, but it was as easy as clicking a button.
>
> it may be easy, but the iphone can't tether to at&t unless you do, and
> only with certain firmwares and appropriate configuration file. most
> people don't jailbreak either. the fact remains that tethering with
> at&t is not supported.

You said "the iphone does not tether with at&t". That's incorrect.

> > I couldn't care less about AT&T's terms of service, to be honest.
>
> that's nice. do you just abide by whatever agreements you feel like?

Most of us do, yep.

> > I don't
> > use tethering all that often to begin with, and data is data so it
> > should be an option, IMO. Plus AT&T falsely advertised that tethering
> > would be available long ago and has long since missed that date.
>
> so you admit there is no tethering with at&t, and yes, they're
> incompetent buffoons.

Like you said, it's not supported, but that obviously doesn't mean you
can't do it.

--
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
messages through their servers, I often ignore posts from Google
Groups. Use a real news client if you want me to see your posts.

JR

[Elmo P. Shagnasty]

In article <310520101229542685%nospam@nospam.invalid>,
nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:

> > I couldn't care less about AT&T's terms of service, to be honest.
>
> that's nice. do you just abide by whatever agreements you feel like?

Now wait a minute. He cares just as much about his agreement with AT&T
as AT&T does about their agreement with him.

[nospam]

In article <jollyroger-F631C9.15312031052010@news.individual.net>,
Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:

> You said "the iphone does not tether with at&t". That's incorrect.

it's exactly correct, and you even admit that's the case, saying at&t
falsely advertised the ability.

it's only possible if you hack the phone, void the warranty and violate
the terms of service.

you also may not be able to upgrade firmware, as many people found out
the hard way and ended up with a non-functional iphone. others were
more fortunate and just lost the ability to tether when they upgraded.

furthermore, at&t tethering is rumoured to be *new* in iphone os 4.0:

<http://www.macrumors.com/2010/05/18/...r-atandt-custo
mers-to-finally-arrive-with-iphone-os-4-0/>

> > > I couldn't care less about AT&T's terms of service, to be honest.
> >
> > that's nice. do you just abide by whatever agreements you feel like?
>
> Most of us do, yep.

no, most people do not ignore agreements they make.

> > > I don't
> > > use tethering all that often to begin with, and data is data so it
> > > should be an option, IMO. Plus AT&T falsely advertised that tethering
> > > would be available long ago and has long since missed that date.

[Jolly Roger]

In article <310520101519313314%nospam@nospam.invalid>,
nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:

> In article <jollyroger-F631C9.15312031052010@news.individual.net>,
> Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:
>
> > You said "the iphone does not tether with at&t". That's incorrect.
>
> it's exactly correct

Nope. It's incorrect, because the iPhone DOES tether.

> it's only possible if you hack the phone, void the warranty and violate
> the terms of service.

It may not tether the way you seem to think is best, but it absolutely
DOES tether. I just did it yesterday, and it works fine.

I'm not going to argue any more about this with you. Feel free to have
the last word.

> you also may not be able to upgrade firmware, as many people found out
> the hard way and ended up with a non-functional iphone. others were
> more fortunate and just lost the ability to tether when they upgraded.

If you know what you are doing you can upgrade just fine without issue.

> furthermore, at&t tethering is rumoured to be *new* in iphone os 4.0:
>
> <http://www.macrumors.com/2010/05/18/...r-atandt-custo
> mers-to-finally-arrive-with-iphone-os-4-0/>

I care not, because I am already able to tether today. And I don't have
to pay extra to do it, as I suspect you will once it's included and
officially supported in iPhone 4.0.

> > > > I couldn't care less about AT&T's terms of service, to be honest.
> > >
> > > that's nice. do you just abide by whatever agreements you feel like?
> >
> > Most of us do, yep.
>
> no, most people do not ignore agreements they make.

I don't care. To me, it's my data and I will use it how I wish. AT&T can
suck it if they don't like it.

--
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
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JR

[nospam]

In article <jollyroger-CA82C8.17322231052010@news.individual.net>,
Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:

> > > You said "the iphone does not tether with at&t". That's incorrect.
> >
> > it's exactly correct
>
> Nope. It's incorrect, because the iPhone DOES tether.

it's exactly correct. an iphone can only tether if it's jailbroken,
something 90% of iphone users do not do, and an appropriate
configuration file loaded, something even fewer people do.

so yes it can tether if you hack it, but that's not something that is
normally considered a feature of the phone.

the iphone can even be hacked to run android. are you now going to
claim it's a universal phone?

> > you also may not be able to upgrade firmware, as many people found out
> > the hard way and ended up with a non-functional iphone. others were
> > more fortunate and just lost the ability to tether when they upgraded.
>
> If you know what you are doing you can upgrade just fine without issue.

big if. many people upgraded and were screwed. those who needed an
unlock could no longer use their iphone *at all*. some were stuck on
the activation screen so they couldn't even use it as an ipod or mobile
internet device. a brick, in other words.

> > > > > I couldn't care less about AT&T's terms of service, to be honest.
> > > >
> > > > that's nice. do you just abide by whatever agreements you feel like?
> > >
> > > Most of us do, yep.
> >
> > no, most people do not ignore agreements they make.
>
> I don't care. To me, it's my data and I will use it how I wish. AT&T can
> suck it if they don't like it.

charming.

[Jolly Roger]

In article <310520101548197012%nospam@nospam.invalid>,
nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:

> In article <jollyroger-CA82C8.17322231052010@news.individual.net>,
> Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:
>
> > > > You said "the iphone does not tether with at&t". That's incorrect.
> > >
> > > it's exactly correct
> >
> > Nope. It's incorrect, because the iPhone DOES tether.
>
> it's exactly correct. an iphone can only tether if it's jailbroken,

Which means it CAN tether. You said it, not me. Stop trying to argue
about it. You said "the iphone does not tether with at&t". That's
incorrect.

> > If you know what you are doing you can upgrade just fine without issue.
>
> big if. many people upgraded and were screwed. those who needed an
> unlock could no longer use their iphone *at all*. some were stuck on
> the activation screen so they couldn't even use it as an ipod or mobile
> internet device. a brick, in other words.

A smart person would have restored their phone before upgrading.

> > > > > > I couldn't care less about AT&T's terms of service, to be honest.
> > > > >
> > > > > that's nice. do you just abide by whatever agreements you feel like?
> > > >
> > > > Most of us do, yep.
> > >
> > > no, most people do not ignore agreements they make.
> >
> > I don't care. To me, it's my data and I will use it how I wish. AT&T can
> > suck it if they don't like it.
>
> charming.

Deal with it.

--
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
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JR

[nospam]

In article <jollyroger-A1D0D9.18005131052010@news.individual.net>,
Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:

> > > > > You said "the iphone does not tether with at&t". That's incorrect.
> > > >
> > > > it's exactly correct
> > >
> > > Nope. It's incorrect, because the iPhone DOES tether.
> >
> > it's exactly correct. an iphone can only tether if it's jailbroken,
>
> Which means it CAN tether. You said it, not me. Stop trying to argue
> about it. You said "the iphone does not tether with at&t". That's
> incorrect.

i'm not the one who is arguing. the iphone *can't* tether to at&t
unless it's jailbroken, and if you include hacks, the iphone can do
quite a bit more, including folders, third party apps that run in the
background and even android.

it's ludicrous to claim the iphone can tether to at&t, when a hack and
tos violation is required to do so. the vast majority of users do not
jailbreak, which means no at&t tethering. period.

> > > If you know what you are doing you can upgrade just fine without issue.
> >
> > big if. many people upgraded and were screwed. those who needed an
> > unlock could no longer use their iphone *at all*. some were stuck on
> > the activation screen so they couldn't even use it as an ipod or mobile
> > internet device. a brick, in other words.
>
> A smart person would have restored their phone before upgrading.

actually, that would have been a big mistake. restoring a new firmware
without the proper precautions could potentially brick it.

[Michelle Steiner]

In article <jollyroger-A1D0D9.18005131052010@news.individual.net>,
Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:

> > > > > You said "the iphone does not tether with at&t". That's
> > > > > incorrect.
> > > >
> > > > it's exactly correct
> > >
> > > Nope. It's incorrect, because the iPhone DOES tether.
> >
> > it's exactly correct. an iphone can only tether if it's jailbroken,
>
> Which means it CAN tether. You said it, not me. Stop trying to argue
> about it. You said "the iphone does not tether with at&t". That's
> incorrect.

How about you both agree to "The iPhone does not tether with AT&T unless it
is jailbroken. This is subject to change without advance notice."?

--
Check out the Hot Cocoa Party
<http://www.hotcocoaparty.info>

[Jolly Roger]

In article <michelle-22EB60.17265131052010@news.eternal-september.org>,
Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

> In article <jollyroger-A1D0D9.18005131052010@news.individual.net>,
> Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > > You said "the iphone does not tether with at&t". That's
> > > > > > incorrect.
> > > > >
> > > > > it's exactly correct
> > > >
> > > > Nope. It's incorrect, because the iPhone DOES tether.
> > >
> > > it's exactly correct. an iphone can only tether if it's jailbroken,
> >
> > Which means it CAN tether. You said it, not me. Stop trying to argue
> > about it. You said "the iphone does not tether with at&t". That's
> > incorrect.
>
> How about you both agree to "The iPhone does not tether with AT&T unless it
> is jailbroken. This is subject to change without advance notice."?

I'm down with that.

--
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
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JR

[Jolly Roger]

In article <310520101611441293%nospam@nospam.invalid>,
nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:

> In article <jollyroger-A1D0D9.18005131052010@news.individual.net>,
> Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > > You said "the iphone does not tether with at&t". That's incorrect.
> > > > >
> > > > > it's exactly correct
> > > >
> > > > Nope. It's incorrect, because the iPhone DOES tether.
> > >
> > > it's exactly correct. an iphone can only tether if it's jailbroken,
> >
> > Which means it CAN tether. You said it, not me. Stop trying to argue
> > about it. You said "the iphone does not tether with at&t". That's
> > incorrect.
>
> i'm not the one who is arguing. the iphone *can't* tether to at&t
> unless it's jailbroken, and if you include hacks, the iphone can do
> quite a bit more, including folders, third party apps that run in the
> background and even android.
>
> it's ludicrous to claim the iphone can tether to at&t, when a hack and
> tos violation is required to do so.

No, it's a simple fact that it is possible.

If you had mentioned jail breaking or TOS in your initial statement "the
iphone does not tether with at&t", perhaps we wouldn't be having this
discussion. But you claimed it could not be done, which is incorrect.

> > > > If you know what you are doing you can upgrade just fine without issue.
> > >
> > > big if. many people upgraded and were screwed. those who needed an
> > > unlock could no longer use their iphone *at all*. some were stuck on
> > > the activation screen so they couldn't even use it as an ipod or mobile
> > > internet device. a brick, in other words.
> >
> > A smart person would have restored their phone before upgrading.
>
> actually, that would have been a big mistake. restoring a new firmware
> without the proper precautions could potentially brick it.

I'm talking about restoring *with* the proper precautions. Nice try,
though.

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JR