Do older routers have speed limitations? not work with powerboost?

[riggor9999]

All - I have an interesting question .....

I have a BEFSR11 router that I have not been using for a while (this has
last firmware available - from 2004). I am a Comcast customer and I am
using a BEFCMU10 DOCSIS 1.1 cable modem.

I was using a Vonage / Motorola VT2442 router but I needed more flexibility
with firewall rules - so I put back my BEFSR11 in place, and put the VT2442
behind the BEFSR11 (via my gigabit switch) and the only thing connected to
the VT2442 is the phone. Phone works fine - no issues.

Cable modem <---> BEFSR11 <---> 24 port gigabit switch <---> pcs,
printers, VT2442, blu-ray player, wireless access points, wii, itouch, etc.

Since I made the change - I noticed my download speeds have slowed down. I
have also gone to the variety of speed test sites and what I basically see
is that powerboost is not working or not there.

I tried these sites - which always show download speeds that include the
effects of powerboost - but now - I always get 6mb down and 3mb up.

http://speedtest.comcast.net/
http://www.speedtest.net/index.php
http://www.speakeasy.net/speedtest/

I looked through the Linksys support sites and various forums but could not
find the answer .... Is there a speed limit to the BEFSR11? Or more
specifically - do older routers not work with Powerboost?

I have not put anything back they way it was - because I need the better /
more flexible firewall rules that the BEFSR11 has and the VT2442 does not.

Thx

[daytripper]

On Wed, 4 Mar 2009 07:55:04 -0500, "riggor9999" <riggor9999@nospam_yahoo.com>
wrote:

>All - I have an interesting question .....
>
>I have a BEFSR11 router that I have not been using for a while (this has
>last firmware available - from 2004). I am a Comcast customer and I am
>using a BEFCMU10 DOCSIS 1.1 cable modem.
>
>I was using a Vonage / Motorola VT2442 router but I needed more flexibility
>with firewall rules - so I put back my BEFSR11 in place, and put the VT2442
>behind the BEFSR11 (via my gigabit switch) and the only thing connected to
>the VT2442 is the phone. Phone works fine - no issues.
>
>Cable modem <---> BEFSR11 <---> 24 port gigabit switch <---> pcs,
>printers, VT2442, blu-ray player, wireless access points, wii, itouch, etc.
>
>Since I made the change - I noticed my download speeds have slowed down. I
>have also gone to the variety of speed test sites and what I basically see
>is that powerboost is not working or not there.
>
>I tried these sites - which always show download speeds that include the
>effects of powerboost - but now - I always get 6mb down and 3mb up.
>
>http://speedtest.comcast.net/
>http://www.speedtest.net/index.php
>http://www.speakeasy.net/speedtest/
>
>I looked through the Linksys support sites and various forums but could not
>find the answer .... Is there a speed limit to the BEFSR11? Or more
>specifically - do older routers not work with Powerboost?
>
>I have not put anything back they way it was - because I need the better /
>more flexible firewall rules that the BEFSR11 has and the VT2442 does not.
>
>Thx

I'm thinking the WAN port is 10base-T, which would pretty much explain the
throttling of your internet connection...

[JR Weiss]

"riggor9999" <riggor9999@nospam_yahoo.com> wrote...
>
> Cable modem <---> BEFSR11 <---> 24 port gigabit switch <---> pcs, printers,
> VT2442, blu-ray player, wireless access points, wii, itouch, etc.
>
> Since I made the change - I noticed my download speeds have slowed down. I
> have also gone to the variety of speed test sites and what I basically see is
> that powerboost is not working or not there.
>
> I looked through the Linksys support sites and various forums but could not
> find the answer .... Is there a speed limit to the BEFSR11? Or more
> specifically - do older routers not work with Powerboost?

Those old routers had 10 Mbps WAN ports. They worked fine when the best you
could EVER get from cable was 12 Mbps, and most of us were lucky to get 5...

[riggor9999]

"daytripper" <day_trippr@REMOVEyahoo.com> wrote in message
news:cv4tq4pa83f8um2ki0g067ftb8q0rjmhht@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 4 Mar 2009 07:55:04 -0500, "riggor9999"
> <riggor9999@nospam_yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
>>All - I have an interesting question .....
>>
>>I have a BEFSR11 router that I have not been using for a while (this has
>>last firmware available - from 2004). I am a Comcast customer and I am
>>using a BEFCMU10 DOCSIS 1.1 cable modem.
>>
>>I was using a Vonage / Motorola VT2442 router but I needed more
>>flexibility
>>with firewall rules - so I put back my BEFSR11 in place, and put the
>>VT2442
>>behind the BEFSR11 (via my gigabit switch) and the only thing connected to
>>the VT2442 is the phone. Phone works fine - no issues.
>>
>>Cable modem <---> BEFSR11 <---> 24 port gigabit switch <---> pcs,
>>printers, VT2442, blu-ray player, wireless access points, wii, itouch,
>>etc.
>>
>>Since I made the change - I noticed my download speeds have slowed down. I
>>have also gone to the variety of speed test sites and what I basically see
>>is that powerboost is not working or not there.
>>
>>I tried these sites - which always show download speeds that include the
>>effects of powerboost - but now - I always get 6mb down and 3mb up.
>>
>>http://speedtest.comcast.net/
>>http://www.speedtest.net/index.php
>>http://www.speakeasy.net/speedtest/
>>
>>I looked through the Linksys support sites and various forums but could
>>not
>>find the answer .... Is there a speed limit to the BEFSR11? Or more
>>specifically - do older routers not work with Powerboost?
>>
>>I have not put anything back they way it was - because I need the better /
>>more flexible firewall rules that the BEFSR11 has and the VT2442 does not.
>>
>>Thx
>
> I'm thinking the WAN port is 10base-T, which would pretty much explain the
> throttling of your internet connection...

That is exactly it ... I did not think to check - ugh ...

WAN: 10Mbps (10BaseT Ethernet)

LAN: 10Mbps (10BaseT Ethernet) or 100Mbps (100BaseTX Fast Ethernet)

[riggor9999]

"JR Weiss" <jrweiss@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
news:gomirq$f98$1@news.motzarella.org...
> "riggor9999" <riggor9999@nospam_yahoo.com> wrote...
>>
>> Cable modem <---> BEFSR11 <---> 24 port gigabit switch <---> pcs,
>> printers, VT2442, blu-ray player, wireless access points, wii, itouch,
>> etc.
>>
>> Since I made the change - I noticed my download speeds have slowed down.
>> I have also gone to the variety of speed test sites and what I basically
>> see is that powerboost is not working or not there.
>>
>> I looked through the Linksys support sites and various forums but could
>> not find the answer .... Is there a speed limit to the BEFSR11? Or more
>> specifically - do older routers not work with Powerboost?
>
> Those old routers had 10 Mbps WAN ports. They worked fine when the best
> you could EVER get from cable was 12 Mbps, and most of us were lucky to
> get 5...
>
>

That is exactly it ... I did not think to check - ugh ...

WAN: 10Mbps (10BaseT Ethernet)

LAN: 10Mbps (10BaseT Ethernet) or 100Mbps (100BaseTX Fast Ethernet)

[Steve Baker]

On Wed, 4 Mar 2009 18:42:18 -0500, "riggor9999"
<riggor9999@nospam_yahoo.com> wrote:

>>>I tried these sites - which always show download speeds that include the
>>>effects of powerboost - but now - I always get 6mb down and 3mb up.
....

>> I'm thinking the WAN port is 10base-T, which would pretty much explain the
>> throttling of your internet connection...
>
>That is exactly it ... I did not think to check - ugh ...
>
>WAN: 10Mbps (10BaseT Ethernet)

That wouldn't limit you to 6 Mb, though. I'm gonna guess that that
problem is about Powerboost needing DOCSIS 1.1+.

--
Steve Baker

[riggor9999]

"Steve Baker" <bakesph@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:fj5uq41bl5cc1iu85q1u8kmldbuhlst9l5@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 4 Mar 2009 18:42:18 -0500, "riggor9999"
> <riggor9999@nospam_yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>>>>I tried these sites - which always show download speeds that include the
>>>>effects of powerboost - but now - I always get 6mb down and 3mb up.
> ...
>
>>> I'm thinking the WAN port is 10base-T, which would pretty much explain
>>> the
>>> throttling of your internet connection...
>>
>>That is exactly it ... I did not think to check - ugh ...
>>
>>WAN: 10Mbps (10BaseT Ethernet)
>
> That wouldn't limit you to 6 Mb, though. I'm gonna guess that that
> problem is about Powerboost needing DOCSIS 1.1+.

It was fine with the same cable modem and the motorola vt2442 router. I am
guessing that since the wan interface is only 10mb ... powerboost senses the
limitation and stops "boosting" so it falls back to the standard 6mb.

http://www.comcast.net/powerboost/

[daytripper]

On Wed, 04 Mar 2009 19:06:18 -0500, Steve Baker <bakesph@comcast.net> wrote:

>On Wed, 4 Mar 2009 18:42:18 -0500, "riggor9999"
><riggor9999@nospam_yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>>>>I tried these sites - which always show download speeds that include the
>>>>effects of powerboost - but now - I always get 6mb down and 3mb up.
>...
>
>>> I'm thinking the WAN port is 10base-T, which would pretty much explain the
>>> throttling of your internet connection...
>>
>>That is exactly it ... I did not think to check - ugh ...
>>
>>WAN: 10Mbps (10BaseT Ethernet)
>
> That wouldn't limit you to 6 Mb, though. I'm gonna guess that that
>problem is about Powerboost needing DOCSIS 1.1+.

Ethernet uses 8b/10b coding, so even *before* you strip out packet headers and
other cruft, the maximum payload throughput - on a good day going down hill
with a supersonic tail wind is 8Mbit/second...

[Steve Baker]

On Wed, 04 Mar 2009 21:19:06 -0500, daytripper
<day_trippr@REMOVEyahoo.com> wrote:

>Ethernet uses 8b/10b coding, so even *before* you strip out packet headers and
>other cruft, the maximum payload throughput - on a good day going down hill
>with a supersonic tail wind is 8Mbit/second...

Hmm. My old 10 Mb NIC would do right around 10 Mb on LAN transfers
(according to an FTP program).

--
Steve Baker

[Rob -- invalid]

"riggor9999" <riggor9999@nospam_yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:goltn6$7ht$1@news.motzarella.org...
> All - I have an interesting question .....
>
> I have a BEFSR11 router that I have not been using for a while (this has
> last firmware available - from 2004). I am a Comcast customer and I am
> using a BEFCMU10 DOCSIS 1.1 cable modem.
>
> I was using a Vonage / Motorola VT2442 router but I needed more
> flexibility with firewall rules - so I put back my BEFSR11 in place, and
> put the VT2442 behind the BEFSR11 (via my gigabit switch) and the only
> thing connected to the VT2442 is the phone. Phone works fine - no issues.
>
> Cable modem <---> BEFSR11 <---> 24 port gigabit switch <---> pcs,
> printers, VT2442, blu-ray player, wireless access points, wii, itouch,
> etc.
>
> Since I made the change - I noticed my download speeds have slowed down. I
> have also gone to the variety of speed test sites and what I basically see
> is that powerboost is not working or not there.
>
> I tried these sites - which always show download speeds that include the
> effects of powerboost - but now - I always get 6mb down and 3mb up.
>
> http://speedtest.comcast.net/
> http://www.speedtest.net/index.php
> http://www.speakeasy.net/speedtest/
>
> I looked through the Linksys support sites and various forums but could
> not find the answer .... Is there a speed limit to the BEFSR11? Or more
> specifically - do older routers not work with Powerboost?
>
> I have not put anything back they way it was - because I need the better /
> more flexible firewall rules that the BEFSR11 has and the VT2442 does not.
>
> Thx
>
>
>

Bypass the (BEFSR41) router (direct to the computer) and I get 22 mbps.
Via the router I get 5 mbps.

[Rob -- invalid]

"riggor9999" <riggor9999@nospam_yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:gon3l7$600$1@news.motzarella.org...
>
> "JR Weiss" <jrweiss@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
> news:gomirq$f98$1@news.motzarella.org...
>> "riggor9999" <riggor9999@nospam_yahoo.com> wrote...
>>>
>>> Cable modem <---> BEFSR11 <---> 24 port gigabit switch <---> pcs,
>>> printers, VT2442, blu-ray player, wireless access points, wii, itouch,
>>> etc.
>>>
>>> Since I made the change - I noticed my download speeds have slowed down.
>>> I have also gone to the variety of speed test sites and what I basically
>>> see is that powerboost is not working or not there.
>>>
>>> I looked through the Linksys support sites and various forums but could
>>> not find the answer .... Is there a speed limit to the BEFSR11? Or more
>>> specifically - do older routers not work with Powerboost?
>>
>> Those old routers had 10 Mbps WAN ports. They worked fine when the best
>> you could EVER get from cable was 12 Mbps, and most of us were lucky to
>> get 5...
>>
>>
>
> That is exactly it ... I did not think to check - ugh ...
>
> WAN: 10Mbps (10BaseT Ethernet)
>
> LAN: 10Mbps (10BaseT Ethernet) or 100Mbps (100BaseTX Fast Ethernet)
>
>

And if you bypass the router and go direct --
you get both 22 mbps and a different IP address.

[f/fgeorge]

On Thu, 5 Mar 2009 06:27:14 -0600, "Rob -- invalid"
<invalid@somewheronearth.INVALID> wrote:

>>
>> I have not put anything back they way it was - because I need the better /
>> more flexible firewall rules that the BEFSR11 has and the VT2442 does not.
>>
>> Thx
>>
>>
>>
>
>Bypass the (BEFSR41) router (direct to the computer) and I get 22 mbps.
>Via the router I get 5 mbps.
>
Time for a new router then! You can always rent one from 'them'. You
know it will work!

[Thomas T. Veldhouse]

In alt.online-service.comcast Steve Baker <bakesph@comcast.net> wrote:
>>WAN: 10Mbps (10BaseT Ethernet)
>
> That wouldn't limit you to 6 Mb, though. I'm gonna guess that that
> problem is about Powerboost needing DOCSIS 1.1+.
>

Actually, with overhead, it might limit you to 8Mbps. My guess is that
particular modem, they simply limit to 6 Mbps as a configuration choice rather
than telling it to "open up".

--
Thomas T. Veldhouse

Religion is a crutch, but that's okay... humanity is a cripple.

[Thomas T. Veldhouse]

In alt.online-service.comcast Steve Baker <bakesph@comcast.net> wrote:
> On Wed, 04 Mar 2009 21:19:06 -0500, daytripper
> <day_trippr@REMOVEyahoo.com> wrote:
>
>>Ethernet uses 8b/10b coding, so even *before* you strip out packet headers and
>>other cruft, the maximum payload throughput - on a good day going down hill
>>with a supersonic tail wind is 8Mbit/second...
>
> Hmm. My old 10 Mb NIC would do right around 10 Mb on LAN transfers
> (according to an FTP program).
>

The software must have been reporting incorrectly then. There is transport
overhead [i.e. ethernet frames] and there is TCP/IP protocol overhead, both of
which affect an FTP transfer. The previous poster is correct ... 8Mbps on a
good day [which is about 1.0 MB/s].

--
Thomas T. Veldhouse

Religion is a crutch, but that's okay... humanity is a cripple.

[Thad Floryan]

On Mar 5, 5:30 am, f/fgeorge <ffgeo...@yourplace.com> wrote:
> On Thu, 5 Mar 2009 06:27:14 -0600, "Rob -- invalid"
>
> <inva...@somewheronearth.INVALID> wrote:
>
> >> I have not put anything back they way it was - because I need the better /
> >> more flexible firewall rules that the BEFSR11 has and the VT2442 does not.
>
> >> Thx
>
> >Bypass the (BEFSR41) router (direct to the computer) and I get 22 mbps.
> >Via the router I get 5 mbps.
>
> Time for a new router then! You can always rent one from 'them'. You
> know it will work!

Except you'll pay 5x or more over its lifetime than buying one
yourself.

The BEFSR41 routers are typically $55 or so. If you do choose to buy
one,
make sure it's at least a hardware version 4.3; the earlier versions
don't
have a 100 Mbps WAN port.

FWIW, my setup is:

||
Motorola Surfboard SB5101
||
SonicWall TZ-170 Hardware Firewall
||
Linksys BEFSR41 Version 4.3
||
LAN switches

Comcast rolled-out DOCSIS 3.0 here on March 3; I ran the
speedtest, results here:

<http://thadlabs.com/PIX/Comcast_20090303.jpg>

An article describing the DOCSIS 3.0 rollout is here:

<http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/blogs/sfgate/detail?
blogid=19&entry_id=36455>

[$Bill]

Thad Floryan wrote:
>
> Comcast rolled-out DOCSIS 3.0 here on March 3; I ran the
> speedtest, results here:
>
> <http://thadlabs.com/PIX/Comcast_20090303.jpg>

So that's 24/6 Mbps compared to my 6/.5 - how much do you have to
pay for that or is it some sort of a beta deal you have going to
get it at the normal rate ?

[Thad Floryan]

On Mar 6, 1:50 am, "$Bill" <n...@SPAMOLAtodbe.com> wrote:
> Thad Floryan wrote:
>
> > Comcast rolled-out DOCSIS 3.0 here on March 3; I ran the
> > speedtest, results here:
>
> > <http://thadlabs.com/PIX/Comcast_20090303.jpg>
>
> So that's 24/6 Mbps compared to my 6/.5 - how much do you have to
> pay for that or is it some sort of a beta deal you have going to
> get it at the normal rate ?

I have no idea. Those results are what I experienced when
running the test after reading the article in the SF Chronicle
on March 3. It's not clear whether everyone gets the new speed
automatically or not -- there's been no info from Comcast in
this regards.

I've only had Comcast service since July 2008 when I lost my
Sprint Broadband 6 Mbps due to the FCC reallocating frequencies
last year; you can see the microwave antenna I had to use for
Sprint here (and which Sprint apparently abandoned since they
never asked to return it, the modem or power supply (after 10
years' service)):

<http://thadlabs.com/PIX/LX200/>

Though I'm in the heart of Silicon Valley, neither cable nor
DSL were available here until 3 years ago, and I'm apparently
one of the first to have Comcast in this neighborhood (and
only for Internet).

[Thad Floryan]

On Mar 6, 4:10 am, "$Bill" <n...@SPAMOLAtodbe.com> wrote:
> Thad Floryan wrote:
>
> > I have no idea. Those results are what I experienced when
> > running the test after reading the article in the SF Chronicle
> > on March 3. It's not clear whether everyone gets the new speed
> > automatically or not -- there's been no info from Comcast in
> > this regards.
>
> In order to run the test, you'd have to have the service. So you
> got those numbers on your current line ?

Correct.

> What do you pay for it ?

It was a special deal from ComcastOffers.com last year; first 6 months
were $19.95/month, free modem, and $225 in rebates. Present billing is
$42.95/month for what I thought was 6 Mbps inbound, unspecified
outbound,
with SpeedBurst (12 Mbps for the first 30-50 MB or so).

The deals from ComcastOffers.com vary each month. The deal I got was
much
better than some neighbors received several months later.

> From the link you gave - they say all plans are being upgraded:
>
> "*Performance - 12 mbps down/ 2 mbps up for $58.95/month standalone
> and $42.95/month when bundled with another service."
>
> That would be close to my service cost and 2x down and 4x up from
> what I have now.
>
> Let's hope TWC does the same sort of speed upgrades for here.

Heh! :-) Do be aware the local DOCSIS 3.0 rollout was the cause of
several service outages in the wee hours of the morning several times
over the previous month as they presumably upgraded equipment. Weird,
since Comcast has only been in this area for 3 years after they ran
fiber (which I'd see every morning for several months when driving to
work). Given DOCSIS 3.0 has been around for awhile (at least its
specs),
I'm surprised Comcast didn't install such gear when they first entered
this neighborhood.

[paul_0090]

On 2009-03-06, Thad Floryan <thad@thadlabs.com> wrote:
> On Mar 5, 5:30 am, f/fgeorge <ffgeo...@yourplace.com> wrote:
>> On Thu, 5 Mar 2009 06:27:14 -0600, "Rob -- invalid"
>>
>> <inva...@somewheronearth.INVALID> wrote:
>>
>> >> I have not put anything back they way it was - because I need the better /
>> >> more flexible firewall rules that the BEFSR11 has and the VT2442 does not.
>>
>> >> Thx
>>
>> >Bypass the (BEFSR41) router (direct to the computer) and I get 22 mbps.
>> >Via the router I get 5 mbps.
>>
>> Time for a new router then! You can always rent one from 'them'. You
>> know it will work!
>
> Except you'll pay 5x or more over its lifetime than buying one
> yourself.
>
> The BEFSR41 routers are typically $55 or so. If you do choose to buy
> one,
> make sure it's at least a hardware version 4.3; the earlier versions
> don't
> have a 100 Mbps WAN port.
>
............ skipped .........

The pricing is still a gamble. In 7 years, I went thru 3 modems from
comcast; now on the 4th modem which does voice. Renting is cost
effective for me; "it all depends" whether on ever have "problems".