router to router connection problem

[guestuntil]

Hi,

i have a adsl modem router (draytek vigor 2600). It gets a ip address from the ISP. The draytek vigor 2600 has a built in router. Because the vigor isn't wireless i bought a linksys wireless router with 4 port switch (befw11s4).

I connected the linksys wan port to the draytek lan port ( 1 of 4).
All the other pc's in the room are connected to the linksys. Draytek has dhcp off and linksys has dhcp on.

I'll write down the correct ip subnet and gateway for you guys in order to help me out better. My problem is that when i am connected to the linksys i am getting ip address through the dhcp server and i can get online as well but i cannot ping the draytek. When i connect directly to the draytek i cannot access the linksys.
I guess it has something to do with the settings and possible routing.

Draytek configuration:

WAN:
- DHCP (it receives correct settings from the ISP)
LAN:
- ip: 192.168.1.1
- subnet: 255.255.255.0


Linksys configuration:

WAN:
- ip: 192.168.1.3
- subnet: 255.255.255.0
- gateway: 192.168.1.1
- DNS 1: used the ones from my ISP
DNS 2: same as DNS 1

LAN:
- ip: 192.168.1.2
- subnet: 255.255.255.0


Now when i am connected to the linksys router i can go online and everything works, accept i cannot reach http://192.168.1.1 nor can i ping the draytek.

when i enter ipconfig in the command prompt i get the following:

ip 192.168.1.101
subnet 255.255.255.0
default gateway 192.168.1.2
dhcp server 192.168.1.2
dns: the ones i entered manually in the wan configuration of the linksys


now the draytek is connected to the phone line from the draytek there goes a cat5 cable to linkys wan port and from the linksys 4 port switch cables go to the corresponding computers.


Now my problem is that i cannot enter the draytek configuration on http://192.168.1.1 nor can i ping the draytek when connected to the linksys. The same happens when i am directly connected to the draytek and try to ping the linksys. Internet works and everything!

All the help appreciated


Kind regards,
Dalma

[twwabw]

I supposed we can ultimately wade through this, but do you realize you bought the wrong hardware? You should have purchased a wireless access point, not a combo router access point. You have two device on the network performni the same functions.

So before we try to straighten this out, can you return the BEFW11S4 and / or exchange it?

[guestuntil]

hi,

well actually i didn't straighten things out in my story. i did bought the linksys wireless router, long before the draytek. We had internet through a cable modem so it was just attaching the linksys router wan to dhcp and everything worked.

Now we have adsl and i bought the draytek adsl modem. because that modem isn't wireless i attached the linksys to it.

Also i did turn off dhcp server on the draytek, dhcp server is only running on the linksys.

ps. i cannot return the linksys because it's been more than 6 months :(

[YeOldeStonecat]

Well...first, you don't want the LAN sides of each router to be the same, you don't want 192.168.1.XXX on the Vigor, if you have 192.168.1.XXX on the Linky. You'd want the Vigor to be..say, 192.168.0.XXX with the Linky on 192.168.1.XXX.

You can leave DHCP enabled on the Vigor, and on the Linky.

Realize any computers you have behing the Vigor will not network with computers behing the Linky, due to NAT. You can get computers behind the Linky to network to computers behind the Vigor...by opening via IP address.

Or another approach, just use the LAN side of the Linky...uplink cable from LAN of Vigor to LAN of Linky, make sure LAN of Vigor and Linky are both same scope..192.168.1.XXX, but a unique IP, like they are now. This way you're really just using the WAPPIE LAN side of the Linky, ignoring it's WAN side.

[twwabw]

I bought the linksys wireless router, long before the draytek

Ahhh.... that "splains" it.....

Well, it becomes a little complicated to use that device as an access point only, as you cannot turn off nat in gateway mode, and it does not like not finding a WAN ip address. If you try to connect it the way YOSC told you, you'll find it will attempt to reset itself when it cannot find a wan ip, and the device basically lock up. You can however change the mode of the device from a gateway tp a router, which which turn off NAT on the Linky. I would not run 2 DHCP servers personally. I would turn off DHCP on the Linksys, set the ip of your wireless laptop as well as the Linky to a new network address (other than 192.168.2.x- use a 10.0.0.x if you want), effectively putting it into another subnet. You can then make a routing table to route between the Linky and the rest of your lan.

[twwabw]

Just thought about something- what version befw11s4 is this? turn it over and look on the bottom.

[dalma]

thanks to speedguide.net i got my own nick back ! :)


my befw11s4 is version 4.


I am trying to understand your explanation.

I did find the option to change the linksys from gateway to router but i am no network expert so i didn't know what to do next.

Just to avoid any confusion:

Draytek connected to phone line (ADSL).
Linksys connected to Draytek (through wan port on linksys)
All the other computers and switches connected to the linksys. Nothing is connected to the draytek except for the linksys.

Now basically your story tells me to :

- turn off dhcp on the linksys
- change lan of the linksys to 10.0.0.x (i guess not the wan, cause the wan is connected to the draytek through 192.168.1.3)


What i want to achieve is the following:
- all the computers and laptops (wireless) connected to the linksys should have dhcp enabled
- from all the computers and laptops i should be able to ping the draytek and linksys

Dalma

[twwabw]

No- what I'm telling you to do is connect all hard-wired PC's to the Draytek. I don't know anything about that device- does it have switch ports on it?

[twwabw]

I'm also saying disable DHCP on the Linksys, and use static IP's for your laptop. I'll have to see if I can find a config page on one to see how to set up routes.

If you try to connect it the way YOSC told you,..... it wil lock up

To clarify that, I am refering only to YOSC's suggestion of

"just use the LAN side of the Linky...uplink cable from LAN of Vigor to LAN of Linky," That should work, and ought to work, but I believe you'll find the situation I described will happen. I've seen it twice. A Linksys quirk. Can't recall firmware ver on the ones i had the issue with, so you could certainly give it a try.

[dalma]

ok so i could try YOSC way of connecting:"Or another approach, just use the LAN side of the Linky...uplink cable from LAN of Vigor to LAN of Linky, make sure LAN of Vigor and Linky are both same scope..192.168.1.XXX, but a unique IP, like they are now. This way you're really just using the WAPPIE LAN side of the Linky, ignoring it's WAN side."

This means i am kinda transforming my linksys router into a linksys access point cause i am not using wan side just the 4 port switch lan.

Does this mean i should enable dhcp on the draytek and turn it off on the linksys ?


btw these are the characteristics of the draytek:

Robust and effective firewall protection for high-bandwidth Internet connections, suitable for SOHO and Enterprise level users alike.

The firewall features include NAT port blocking, Dos/DDos protection and user configurable filtering, all with full reporting facilities.

Built-in 4-port Auto-sensing 10/100M Base-Tx Ethernet swith offers convenience for home and SOHO users and other small LANs.

Universal Plug'n 'Play (UPnP) Compliant, Integrating with Windows XP for compatibility with MSN Messenger.

[twwabw]

If you want to try YOSC's method of using the Linky as a WAP by connecting only to lan ports, sure- give it a try (I just you'll find it will lock.... hope not though). Anyway, you can only have ONE dhcp server in a network. So turn off whichever one you want. But only one can be handing out IP's on a single subnet.

Connect whichever pcs you want to either device- it shouldn't matter. Choose by convenience of location. Make sure when you connect between the Linky and the draytek that you get a link light- the linky will autoconfigure as an uplink, but I don;t know about the draytek.

As an aside, I would always configure the wireless laptop as static IP anyway- that way you can eleiminate the flaky dhcp servers of the routers as being an issue. Just pick an ip within your network range, (but NOT within dhcp scope range!) and use a subnet mask of 255.255.255.0; gateway IP is the IP of your internet connect router (the Draytek), and under DNS server's, list your Draytek's IP- it will autmatically forward for resolution.

[dalma]

ok twwabw thanks !

i'll try YOSC'S approach first because the draytek is close to the isra point and the linksys is in the room and the 2 switches i have are connected to the linksys.
If I encounter problems i'll go for your option.

Still I don't understand why I cannot ping the draytek from a computer connected to the linksys (when i am using my configuration).

If i had a linksys access point connected to the draytek i wouldn't have this problem ? i would be getting an ip from the draytek dhcp server right ?

thanks for all the replies. I am going to try some things out this week and let you know !

[YeOldeStonecat]

Haven't done it myself...just threw the idea together by theory.

What if you just assign the WAN side of the Linky a static IP(just pick any old IP).....might avoid the lockup if it cannot obtain one?

[YeOldeStonecat]

Then again, if all your computers are simply running from the Linksys, and none are directly plugged into the Vigor....then just go with the first plan...run separate IP scopes on each, daisy chain them.

[dalma]

you mean like a fictive ip

[YeOldeStonecat]

Originally posted by dalma
you mean like a fictive ip

Yeah, just taking a stab at it.

But....lets go back to the plan A...
Vigor Router...192.168.0.1 on the LAN side, running DHCP
Patch cable from LAN port of Vigor to WAN port of Linksys
Linksys WAN side set to obtain auto
Linksys LAN side set to defaults, 192.168.1.1, also running DHCP
All computers connected to (via cable, or wireless) LAN side of Linksys.

Should work fine, I've used that setup many times, using a second router within another router so I can build servers, etc...islated from main network.

[dalma]

Originally posted by YeOldeStonecat
Then again, if all your computers are simply running from the Linksys, and none are directly plugged into the Vigor....then just go with the first plan...run separate IP scopes on each, daisy chain them.

ok when i try this, the wan side of the linksys should be on the same ip range as the vigor otherwise i won't have an internet connection, right?

[YeOldeStonecat]

Originally posted by dalma
ok when i try this, the wan side of the linksys should be on the same ip range as the vigor otherwise i won't have an internet connection, right?

Yes, and what will ensure this, is having the Vigor run DHCP for it's LAN, and setting the Linksys WAN side to obtain auto. That way...and DNS server changes from your ISP, the Vigor will hand out via DHCP, the Linksys will pick up, and naturally pass that out through it's DHCP.

Using this method, you have 2x separate networks...so even though each router is running DHCP...it's not 2x DHCP servers on the same network...you're not breaking that rule by doing this.

[dalma]

great!!

i got (understand :D) it now. Man, what would one be without you guys :)

Btw need one more advice.

I am studying for mcse .

I just passed my first certification from microsoft but I still don't understand alot of stuff with networking.

I guess it would be smart to go for comptia network + certification right?

[twwabw]

The only problem with this type of setup is the inability to access the Linksys side of the network. NAT will block access. This will give you internet access for your lappy, and what ever else is behind the Linksys, but nothing on the other side can connect or share with the linksys side, unless you set up static routes ( = PITA )

I guess it would be smart to go for comptia network + certification right?

That all depends what you want to do with the cert. If you'll use the testing as a way to learn- sure. Otherwise, spend your time learning and setting up networks, rather than studying for tests. Once you know material from a practical and experience standpoint, the cert tests are simple. An MCSE by itself isn't worth much, without some knowledge and experience to back it up. I use mine only as a tool with new clients who don't know what it means- they feel safer knowing I have it I guess :rolleyes: .

[dalma]

ok to sum things up:

when i do this:

Vigor Router...192.168.0.1 on the LAN side, running DHCP
Patch cable from LAN port of Vigor to WAN port of Linksys
Linksys WAN side set to obtain auto
Linksys LAN side set to defaults, 192.168.1.1, also running DHCP
All computers connected to (via cable, or wireless) LAN side of Linksys.

will i be able to access the configuration page of the draytek through one of the computers on the linksys? cause that was the reason why i started this topic :)

[TeddyTed]

i've got a BEFSX41 and a WRT54G (both Linksys) in a similar config and it works okay. It's not fully setup yet cause i think i've got to also setup a routing table to get port forwarding working so i can have my FTP server etc running.


SX41 connected directly to my cable modem, dhcp enabled, ip: 192.168.2.1 (gateway mode)

RT54G dhcp disabled, operating in router mode. 192.168.2.20



it's okay for now but i'll see when i'm done configuring it.


TB

[Sid]

Set the draytek as a bridge and reset the linksys to default and you should be all set to go.

[dalma]

hi guys,

didn't have time last week to play with the networking stuff, but today i had some time and just did some simple things and now it works ok!

Let me explain what i did:

Draytek set up as the main dhcp server.

draytek lan side ip 192.168.1.1

Linkys set up as a normal switch. I turned off dhcp server and just set wan ip to obtain ip automatically

linksys lan side ip 192.168.1.2

all the computers (wired/wireless) are connected to the linksys.

when i do ipconfig , i get a gateway of 192.168.1.1. That is the ip address of the draytek, so the dhcp server works..

Now i can ping both the linksys and the draytek and i can enter the configuration page on both.

Wired and wireless computers can get online, just the i wanted it !

Linksys isn't locking up or anything atm. But fingers crossed :p, it could still happen tonight. It's running for about 15 minutes without any problems.

Download speed 830kb/s and upload 90 kb/s :)